Mar 3
Oprah and Eckhart
I have been flu ridden for several days. Combine that with commitments to travel to conferences and you have a recipe for fatigue not to mention bed time. Well, enough of me. Let’s get on to Oprah.
Oprah is rapidly taking on a more prominent profile of being a spiritual leader, which would not only include her funding the girls school in Africa, but now the show the “Big Giver.” Almost simultaneously, she is launching a ten week web seminar with author, Eckhart Tolle. Over 700,000 have signed up for this broadcast. So my questions to you are this, “Why is this type of program so popular?” And “What do you believe should be done about this?”
I’ll look forward to you comments.
Blessings,
John Paul
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John Paul,
I believe that God has stored up riches for us in everything around us. Yet we are afraid of digging up these riches and utilizing them because of what they might be in at the moment. Wisdom is wisdom wherever you find it and it has all been authored by God or it is not wisdom. I intend to look into everything, find the truths that these people are keeping care of, and bring it to the table of the Lord. There I will feast in his presence. The Lord has told me that like David went looking for Mephibosheth, who was crippled and in hiding, there are so many things that have a place at his table. But we have rejected it through fear. The sons of God are those who will bring truth which has been crippled by other religions or non-religions back to the fullness. Let’s not be afraid anymore.
Blessings,
Sharon
John Paul, thanks for writing! Both my husband and myself will be offering up communion for the restoration of your immune system and overall health. Try some fresh garlic cloves & onion soup with a dash of sea salt, a little cayenne pepper every 2 hours and of course Holy Spirit rest and some quiet worship music and the prayers of the saints here on the earth(Lol).
Now back to Oprah, I personally think people are spiritually hungry and bored with the status quo. Many people are discouraged from the way that they have been treated by those who say they are qualified church leaders as well as everyday believers who for some reason are stunted in their growth regarding character development through spiritual transformation that only the Holy Spirit can offer.
Many Christian leader’s do not seem to understand social injustices, especially in the third world and in impoverished areas in this country because they haven’t lived it, been around it, or been taught about social oppression in a truthful manner.
Many Christian leader’s are impotent in their approach to ministering to the dying, the down trodden, the neglected, the disabled, the poor and the abused of the world and of the church.
Many people who look up to these leaders are sick and tired of the minimalism and apathy that are so prevalent in their ministries. So,when they see somebody who puts their money and their heart where their mouth is, people listen and they run to where they are.
Many people now a days are sensing that something is going on and there needs to be change and surprisingly most people are understanding that there needs to be a spiritual change. And so in the process, they are grabbing for the fast food items. I also am feeling people want the spiritual life at any cost and they “FEAR” looking at themselves in the mirror of who they really are so they seem to avoid the need for “REPENTANCE” as the first step of being freed from their sins.
I also believe that living in this country called America, somehow as American’s we have bought the lie that rugged individualism which embraces the freedom of picking and choosing anything and everything we can ever want or desire is at our finger tips if we want it. This is true to a certain extent. However, this is also a lie. Because the majority of Americans do not have this as an option because economic resources are scarce as well as spiritual resources. This lie has been ingrained in the minds of our youth as the highest ideal that one should strive for and in order for the Kingdom of God to come to the earth, this has got to change in the hearts and mind of fellow believers, as well as Christian leaders throughout the earth, especially in America.
We need to develop as the Body of Christ, a strong authentic voice that embraces everyone and at the same time doesn’t compromise the word of God and the Christian walk.
Taking prayer out of schools has placed even further limitations and discouraged many of the youth in regards to making choices that are Holy in striving for the things of the Holy Spirit.
The “what to strive for” part is the part that seems to be confusing to many people. The “who to work with” is another question. Let’s embrace unity of purpose!
Many people are choosing their spiritual path from their emotional intelligence instead of exercising their “Faith”.
We need to begin with “Faith” and the rest will follow.
In answering the second question what are we to do about it? Let us take the first step and pray and see what the Father is saying from heaven and then because Oprah claims to be a Christian someone should correct her in love with two or three witnesses. I personally am involved in the You Tube Community and have been moved by the Lord, to send Oprah a couple of messages in my shows, I also put her name in the tags so she can find the video when she checks them! And pray for Oprah, she has influence and God can use her as well as correct her. He is a big God!
Be Well & Be Blessed!
Shirley C.
“Why is this type of program so popular?”
To answer that question, I beleive that not only is that program popular, but that ’spiritualality’ of all forms is popular. It is talked about in classrooms and in stores, everywhere I go I hear people talking about things, from ‘the secret’ to ‘metaphysical riddles” or even to Jesus feeding the people miraculously.
I beleive there is a hunger for truth and spirit in our culture today, in the last few years I have seen more people exit the church systems of our nation than I have ever heard of. I have watched people whether they are ‘mormons’ or ‘christians’ or ‘jehovah witnesses’ etc.. leave institutions, not because they didn’t beleive in God, but because they felt that religion has silenced their desire to meet whatever God was out there. Of course, over time, that search leads to questioning the very fundamentals of everything you have ever been taught. I beleive this is the most glorious time to have ever lived in planet earth. I am not one of the doomsdayers, and I beleive that the actual desire to find God and truth is pulling people closer to God than they ever anticipated. It is a movement of searchers as prophecied in the 90s during renewal.. it is a movement in the ‘highways and the byways, outside the walls of the church, and the multitudes were coming to God….”
I sat at lunch with an ex-mormon the other day and talked to her about her views of Jesus and God. Sure she still had some dogma there, but when I asked questions to her which compromised what she had been taught, she gave it careful consideration and then said “I wouldn’t see why not.” The question I asked her, “if God could speak to a man named Joseph smith and give him revelations from heaven, if he indeed received them, don’t you think that God would want us ALL to interact with him that way? Is it possible that we ALL can talk and know God on a personal level?” I was amazed then as she began to open up and share her views of God. She had renounced her religious -doctrines to find God, and she had a clearer picture of the character of God than many church christians I have talked to!
SO to answer the question, these ’spiritually influenced’ programs, books, teachings, movies, etc. are all part of Gods plan in bringing the third great awakening, which is far better and far bigger than revival, it is an awareness in the people that God is with them always, and that we can love him and walk and talk with him…one step closer to the garden.
Ironically, many of the things that God wanted to release to the church, they aren’t accepting so he is using others who are willing and searching.. Has anyone heard that newer sinead O connor song which is God singing to ‘us’ about how much he loves us and what he was thinking when he was creating us and the earth. WOW. that brought some intense tears to my eyes. I am amazed that as the holy spirit continues to flow, even when I am ‘uncomfortable in the flesh’ because the spirit is manifesting with a shake here or there, or with a joy burst in the middle of a random time, those who some would call unbeleivers, actually immediately respond to the spirit, ready and willing to experience whatever they can of God instantaniously…I am so thankful that God chose this hour to have me alive in this earth. He is a perfect perfect God.
so thats my opinion on that question..
“what do you beleive should be done about this?”
My answer to that question is absolutely nothing. NOTHING! Its the most beautiful thing ever. Sometimes I feel like people get caught up in evangelism, prophecy, being a witness etc etc, like we have some duty we are to perform. (I am not saying that is what you were meaning JP by anymeans!) But one thing I noticed is that religious people like to categorize things.
I beleive that as we spend time with Jesus we flow out the life force of him into the earth, we don’t have to ‘do’ anything or even ‘respond’ in anyway. As we become more intune with God our just very existence of Being who he created us to be calls out to those that are hungry, it calls out to those who know we have something to offer, and God works out what I beleive years ago larry something or other taught as “divine appointments’ I remember someone sharing to me how people in their church kept talking about the ‘time they were spending with Jesus’ but yet they were selfish ungrateful people who didn’t care about others at all. I thought about it and responded that maybe they were spending time with a false Jesus, because the Jesus that I knew had an amazing effect on those who spend time with him, they come out of the experience radiating and wanting to love people more than ever before!! Its so strange how churchianity has formed, but I beleive that spending time with the true christ will result in fruit that comes naturally so that people will have to say on judgement day “when did we DO that Lord” because they were flowing in spirit so much they didn’t even know they were doing the doings…
Evangelism, prophecy, apostolic whatever, etc etc could all be summed up in loving Jesus and letting him glow and flow out of us. People hear God stories from me from time to time and ask me how i ‘evangelize’ but I would say that I don’t evangelize at all, I let the light do the working and I just let the light guide me and flow out of me. Jesus is the light of Course, and when he is in charge, striving just drifts away!! The best spiritual conversations and testimonies of Jesus come out of natural flow than walking up to someone and sharing with them a set response..
So, i guess with my long winded comments, I would say if we are going to have ’something done’ about it all.. i would say LOVE JESUS. the rest is just.. well… side effects.
My heart has been extremely heavy concerning Oprah’s influence in the realm of spiritual leadership. From “The Secret” to Marianne Williamson’s “A Course in Miracles” to Eckhart Tolle’s “A New Earth”, she is leading more and more people down a dangerously deceptive path. Just the other day Oprah said on her show (referring to Tolle’s book) that she beleives that she was “born to be a vehicle” to bring this type of information to people. I believe that the types of programs that Oprah has been promoting is so popular because this generation is searching for something that only God can give. This searching of course, is not new, all past generations have searched. But given the times in which we live where truth is relative, there is no such thing as sin, and where political correctness and tolerance outweigh God’s Word, the message that Williamson and Tolle and the like teach is a comfortable fit for our culture. Oprah as a “vehicle” for these messages is appealing to the masses because she is genuinely trying to help and she is very generous so it seems ok to follow her. As to what should be done about it, I have been asking the Lord just that question. “What can we do about all the people who are being led astray?” “What can we do to reach people in this day and this time?” I have been crying out to God about this very matter for the last few weeks. My heart is burdended and broken for those being deceived by these false teachings. If Oprah can influence 700,000 people worldwide to sign up for a ten week course on the internet, why can’t the body of Christ do the same and more? I honestly don’t know what we should do. I just know that surely we (who can do all things through Christ) can do something and that surely, something must be done. I will continue to pray for an outpouring of God’s Holy Spirit for this generation - for such a time as this.
Brother John Paul: Was blessed by your humble statement of illness and fatigue, but was a bit shocked that you made no request for prayer. Ya got mine!!!
I am surprised that you would place spiritual leader in a sentence about Opera. My guess is “a test”? People are hungry for “the filling of that void God placed within us for Him”, thus you have a popular show. What should be done? We need the unity Jesus spoke of, then we shall feed the masses with a few fish, and we shall “appear” where we are most needed at that moment!!! Build it and they shall come
In prayer, as I enter a fast that will bring me to Easter, I was given Romans 8:13 and it became the center of a study of Romans 7 & 8….
8:13-14 For if you live according to the sinful nature, you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live,
because those who are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God.
Enjoy healing and peace JP
What should be done about this? Great question! People are so hungry and the church has left them with a BAD taste in their mouths. I have been asking the Father what I should do regarding this situation. Again, Oprah and I have a relationship (she doesn’t know it, so it’s pretty one sided at this point). I love her and I honestly believe that she thinks that she is doing a good thing….little does she know that she is playing into enemy’s hand. Or is she? What Satan meant for harm God will use for good. She is creating a culture of Christ without Christ. WHen things start to shake people will know that no amount of self-focus will bring rest to their souls. I will continue to pray for Oprah and ask God how I can bring Light into this dark place. I opted out of joining the webcast for several different reasons, but my unsaved mom is reading the book and it has sparked some very awesome conversations. I shouldn’t call my mom unsaved because she believes in Christ (this book has reinforced that for her…of course she has four praying daughters in her corner). My mom I think is not unlike Oprah in that Jesus is her way, but no convinced he’s the only way and the fruit in their lives is questionable. I look forward to hearing what you have to say on this matter. It is no coincidence that you started this blog-site at this time….it all is unfolding before my eyes. I feel like this was just for me!!! A gift from my Dad through one a consider to be a spiritual father. THANKS THANKS THANKS for obedience!!!
My prayers go out to you JP, for your quick recovery. I also pray that you may be able to rest in the middle of such tight schedules…
What can we do about Oprah? I beleive that if anybody is going to do anything, it should be the church as a body…I think that the best thing the church can do is radiate Jesus as accurately as possible…I beleive that the Body of Christ as a whole is in need of a true, deep, honest, life changing reformation that will dig deep into the churches roots, and be given time to work it’s full work…
I beleive that Oprah and Tolle and whoever else will come along, is not the problem, I think that an unaccurate, religious, dull church is what the hungry do not want…
What is left then for them to feed on…anything else that comes along that appeals to their need!
…I read this post yesterday and I didn’t have a clue to what to write - but as I read your comments, things started coming to me…I beleive we need each other more than we can imagine…and we need God beyong what we could ever imagine…
I guess I must stop a bit now to seek Him deeper…
God Bless!
Hi John Paul:
These books and television programs are popular because we the church have abdicated our role, function and purpose.
The world is feeding on these imitations and counterfeits because we haven’t offered them the truth, life and power of God.
The world is content, even thrilled with Oprah’s SPAM casserole because they haven’t tasted the “Texas Ribeye” God has been preparing for them!
Once they’ve tasted steak, spam will never satisfy again. Maybe it’s time for Oprah to get a taste of our “Texas Ribeye”?
Praying that you feel better!
Z
What should we do? repent, the church has not led the way in spiritual leadership
Why is the program so popular? she is trying to address the natural void in one’s heart which only God can fill
Laura
John Paul
Hungry people will feed on poison if that’s all they see or think is available. The past the majority of the church (not God) has beaten down our need to relate to God from our inner most being. I call it the “God hole.” He’s the ONLY one that can fill it. We try to stuff it with all sorts of junk but nothing can fill the void except Him. He created us for fellowship with Him. A intimate, honest and glorious relationship that makes others jealous and draws them in to the same.
What do we do about it?? Each one of us has a circle of influence, family, friends, people we meet everyday. Is my relationship with Jesus so overwhelming on this circle that it demands a response from them? Are they compelled to ask questions?? Do miracles follow me?? Is the fruit of the Spirit increasing in me so that others notice?? Is my character changing?? I’m not talking about being a “good” person. I’m talking about being like Jesus. I believe there is a stirring in the bride of Christ in this direction. So lets get going. Be honest before God and simple ask Him “Search me oh God.” If a hand full of men changed the world a couple thousand years ago, so can we walking in the same anointing, power and authority they did. It’s already in us.
Praying for you JP that the healing power of God would flow in you.
I believe the reason this type of program is so popular is …
because Oprah is popular. She is a dynamic leader. People like to follow her because they think she knows where she is going.
People are starving with thirst for something spiritual. Just as we look for food/water when we are hungry/thirsty in our natural bodies, so it is with our spirit.
She shows a heart of compassion. She listens. She appears approachable. She is teachable, She moves with her heart. She cares. (all of these demonstrate the act of love)
She is successful in the sense of the world’s definition of success.
All these are gifts that God gave her. I pray that they will be used of God in the way He intends/intended.
What should we do about this?
Instead of “Getting the Holy Ghost” allow the Holy Ghost to get us.
Be filled with God’s love.
Be filled with God’s Wisdom.
or to sum it up, Be filled with God.
Pray that God reveal truth to these leaders and that they would have eyes to see and ears to hear. Pray that they would act on the truth. Saul was a powerful spiritual leader and then one day he faced the truth and became Paul. He threw away his old knowledge and determined to know Christ.
The other night I dreamed that I was reading the amp. bible. There was a passage in first chapter of the Book of Daniel that said in the dream, (God brought Daniel here (meaning Babylon) so that he could learn to drive a vehicle.)
The enemy was/is terrified of prayer. That is what they wanted Daniel to stop doing. He still went to his home and prayed. He didn’t do it out at the courthouse, palace, school etc. He went to his home and prayed. (windows open) and later (spent the night peacefully) with the lions while the king tossed and turned.
Even kings became believers in Daniel’s God when their eyes were opened and they saw how God moved in Daniel’s life.
Our (everyone’s) Father, You are in Heaven, Your kingdom come, Your Will Be Done, Here on/in earth (Me) as is in Heaven (no murderers, liars, thieves) …
I have heard it was quoted by a spiritual leader that he loved Christ but didn’t like Christians because the ones he met were so unlike Christ… or something like that.
People came running to see Jesus. It should still be this way today. May He get me to the place where He can move in and through me without hindrance.
Love you guys.
David
JP,
I beleive that the reason that this show is so popular is due to the fact the the Western church has failed to display the glory of God. We have been real good at displaying religion, which has not made us any more popular or appealing than the rest. You have seen yourself lately, the acceptance of the gospel of the kingdom when delivered and demonstrated in a kingdom context. The church has many communicators but not many demonstrators. Oprah is a communicator and as long as that is all that the church is then we will have to compete with her for the same group of people, kind of like churches do in the same town that just communicate religion to the people. Gen. 1:28 gives us the mandate to subdue, rule, and take charge of the earth. Oprah is using her influence to do that. The church must do the same. We have the Spirit of God in us and we must act like. As we demonstrate the glory of the kingdom in the earth society will begin to take notice that there is a greater power in the earth than the one that Oprah claims to have.
I am glad to hear you are on the mend John Paul. There is such an urgency in these times, isn’t there? The saddest thought in the world is that someone else could spend eternity in hell. We appreciate what you do and thank you!!!!
I think Oprah is so popular because she reflects a form of what we all should be doing. She is reaching people all over the world and has the means to back up any endeavor she chooses. I think all of us have that fantasy of being able to write that check for that great cause or build that home for a devastated family. Her show has evolved from a voyeuristic look at the worst in us to addressing these same issues that plague us.
I have not read the book that she is recommending so I cannot comment specifically about it. However I have watched enough of her programs to know that she takes a very humanistic approach to many of her topics. While the giving, encouraging and building up are needed, I believe it is misleading.
When I look at her show and hear her speak, I cannot tell where she stands in Christ. That is a problem for me. Who ever you follow is leading you. Many people follow her show. Where is she leading her audience? Pursue riches and success to what end? The problem is when you take on the role of influence that she has (lifestyle, spending, counsel, advise, pursuits of happiness, etc) and purposefully seek the ears of millions of households you become responsible to those lives you influence. Your understanding or belief of this has nothing to do with it being a fact. One has to examine motivation and foundation (end) to establish the rightness or wrongness of the means.
I think Oprah’s show and thinking represents a common form of schizophrenia in our Christian based society. There are things we can do and accept under the guise of business and entertainment that does not have to pass the Christian test. People say, Ophrah is such a good person, look at what she does with her money. Or, look how Walmart and Exxon helped the Katrina victims. Isn’t that wonderful! I am so longing to hear the world say, look what the Christians have done with their money in the name of the Lord. Look what God is doing.
I take heart, however, in this…the counterfeit always trys to preempt the true and perfect. I am anxiously looking forward to the time when God allows us to step up and demonstrate to the world what His good and prefect plans are for His Kingdom.
-kat
Hey JP,
Blessings to you for your health, I feel for you, not fun stuff.
Robert, I agree with you, man. If we’ve got the real deal, there is nothing more interesting or exciting. I personally think it’s a rebuke to the church that she has the influence she does. There’s a verse that says that we should live as to make the gospel more attractive to outsiders. As you write Robert, we’ve offered them a mouthful of dust in the desert when they’re looking for springs of water.
That being said, JP, when you first posted, you had spelled Oprah, “Opera.” I know that was not your intention, however it struck me since it seems she’s almost like a soap opera, in that she really appeals to emotion in a huge way. She has a drawing power and a following that hang on her every word, very much similar to the drawing power of soap operas and how they lure you in. (Sadly, I’m speaking from personal experience - I got hooked on General Hospital for a few months in the early ’80’s after taking some time off from school. Don’t ask me how, it just happened as I watched it).
Oprah has overcome a lot in her life in some respects. Yet, pundits have said that she preaches a “gospel” (which is really no gospel at all) of flagrant self-indulgence. And in her appeal to emotion, she really is addressing the soul and seeking to excite the soul, as is Tolle. I looked at Tolle’s sight and it appears (without a lot of research or study) that he’s got a lot of Hinduism/Buddishm type-stuff, delving into your inner person (soul) to find yourself. But, in neat packaging.
So what should we do? For me, breaking out of my Christian box of moralism, and engaging people in the supernaturalness of God, i.e., asking them about their dreams, and asking God for interpretation, asking them about their spiritual hunger, trying to tap into their spiritual hunger, using Christian ideas but not in Christian/church language.
Again, for me it’s a huge rebuke. Tolle is clearly not leading people in the way or to The Way.
Blessings,
Dennis
John Paul
my view may be a little over simplified but i believe it is the giving.
What was the display Jesus did while on this earth; of course it was to display the person of His father, and that was the greatest giver of all good things. The provider for great needs and the rescuer from hard and impossible places.
Some have spoken already on the many churches shortcoming of being a giver and it has been displayed to many as being a taker and not a giver.
How many times have you heard, all they want is my money.
I believe that with the churches lack of giving the world the same things that Jesus offered and displaying the Glory of God, which i believe is being the greatest giver; we are seeing another step into that empty void that the church should have filled and Oprah wouldn’t look so incredible.
I also believe that if/when we step into that role we are destined to be, the Oprahs of this world will be a poor substitute to what we offer.
The god of this world has blinded their eyes and ONLY GOD can open blind spiritual eyes. We should pray that the Holy Spirit influences their hearts first so they will be receptive to the Word when the time is right.
These are good questions. Since you began your posts on Spirituality, the Lord has had me taking a crash course on new age philosophies that are creeping into certain segments of the church, so I have been asking myself these very questions on a broader scale.
Why is her program so popular?–Partly, I think, because as we become more affluent as a nation people are feeling less and less fulfilled. At the end of the day they may have a beautiful home and a fancy car, but they are empty and miserable. The feel good message of Oprah and the people she touts offer to fill that void. I looked at her site to read about this class and when I read this–”Connect with others who are seeking to become more aware of themselves—and the world around them,” a little light bulb went off. It’s all about making yourself feel better. It’s all about me. Whereas being a Christian requires the sacrifice of self, which is not nearly so easy as saving a few whales. It’s also the “NOW! mentality we see in the proliferation of diet and self-help books which tell us we can lose weight/feel better in minutes if we follow these 34 simple steps.
I think it also has to do with generosity. As far as I can tell, this course is being offered for free. This is something we don’t often see in Christian ministries. It’s all about us giving to them, then they can give to us. She just gives. Of course, this is a fine line since ministries do need money to function, and there is a cost in manufacturing cd’s, etc. Also, this man is making himself available to almost a million people. Think of the enormity of that. (I just want to insert here how much I appreciate you making yourself available to us through this blog.) This is something I have thought a lot about. Five years ago I began to write the first in a series of YA novels about the Seven Spirits of God. I had visions of fame and fortune as I took the Christian publishing industry by storm. Five years later after trials, triumphs, twins and various other life events, I found myself at the place where I had to ask myself why the Lord placed this story in my heart–was it for the hope of money/fame or to bless others. So I have become keenly aware of generosity in others. When the world sees “ministers” of the gospel in their expensive suits and fancy cars, is it any wonder they are totally put off? Thankfully there are ministries whose main concern is people, not possessions, but they often fly under the radar.
I could probably come up with plenty more reasons, but those were the two that came to mind first, plus others have already written some of them.
What should be done about this?–”The White Rabbit put on his spectacles. ‘Where shall I begin, please your Majesty?’ he asked. ‘Begin at the beginning,’ the King said gravely, ‘and go on till you come to the end: then stop.’”-Lewis Carroll.
I also had the thought that change begins at home. We have to be willing to let the Lord show us the deceptions in our own lives and repent. We must be able to defend our faith when challenged, not submit to the world’s will out of a false sense of humility or fear. We must care nothing for our own reputations and care a lot for the lost and bewildered. When we see a friend reading a questionable book do we confront them or tell ourselves we’ll just pray about it later. I believe we must be aware of our own callings and walk in them to be most effective. We must allow the Holy Spirit to invade/occupy us and our lives. Most of all, we must not be passive and pretend that nothing is wrong.
Lastly, if you do another q&a, what do you think of the statement that wherever we find truth, we find God(coming from a Christian)?
To the “Collective” Blog,
I think some of the most influential people in the world today are either the most successful or the most outlandish (or sometimes both). The most outlandish get written off as either entertaining or crazy. The most successful are looked to for answers. Oprah strikes me as successful without being outlandish. I haven’t seen her show but I’ve read her magazines from time to time. She has interesting articles that cover a wide variety of topics. I feel she is a ‘middle ground’ kind of a person. I perceive her as being one whom many can relate to.
On the other hand, it is often hard for people to relate to the church. I feel like I don’t fit in church and I’m very familiar with it. How much more for someone who is not familiar with it? I have tried (in the past) to lead people to a fulfilling relationship with God. I saw people supposedly having a wonderful relationship with God and tried to lead others to the same. I didn’t ‘get it’ myself….and I still don’t I might add.
I went to Eckhart Tolle’s website to see what it was all about and it was instantly appealing. Right there on the front of his new book cover it says “Awakening to Your Life’s Purposes.” Boy that would be nice to know! I mean, I know the Christian answer…that I have a purpose to be in relationship with Christ so then why do I still feel left wanting? I’m pretty sure my experience is not an isolated case. Eckhart Tolle is appealing to people who feel something is missing. Money, success, fame, popularity, and such desirable life goals don’t truly fulfill. I and others want more. Who can provide demonstration to go with their words?
I don’t perceive Eckhart Tolle as one to guarantee a particular result from his book. I could be completely wrong about this. What does this mean to not have a definable result? It means he is safe. He is suggesting that people need to ‘become’ spiritual to find true purpose but doesn’t promise ‘things.’ He is safe because there isn’t much of a measurable result. However, the Bible is full of promises with measurable results. These results ARE lacking in the world today. Again, who can provide the demonstration to go with their words?
In the description on Tolle’s web site concerning his new book “A New Earth,” he begins by quoting a Scripture. He does poorly in tying it into the rest of his text but that seems to be ok to the spiritual seeker. They are probably feeling linked to something greater without feeling forced into their perception of dogmatic Christianity. That Scripture really didn’t need to be there for him to get his point across. He is using it to draw people in. The Scripture is taken out of context but Tolle is probably not into apologetics.
Tolle’s short introduction to his new book is written on a readable level but by using vague undefined words he probably is appealing to those who are more intellectual. His “collective consciousness” and “collective egoic dysfunction” probably appeal to readers even though they do not know what it means because they want to think they are intelligent. So, he has appealed to a spiritual, often thought of as less intelligent side of human experience, while appealing to the intellect. Maybe there is a way for the sophisticated, successful, wealthy, intelligent individual to find a ‘spiritual’ connection and thus define their life as being for a greater reason than the day to day rat race life currently affords. This I believe is one of the appeals to Americans.
The Western world is notably different in its thinking and what is appealing. Having a great majority of earthly goods and experiences without satisfaction, true fulfillment is being sought in spirituality. I hypothesize that whoever can produce results first or at least create the illusion of results will be the winner of this spiritual race. As for how the church can fulfill that I don’t know. I don’t have the answers for myself let alone for someone else.
I hope that my frank opinion is of benefit.
Let me add that I feel I have betrayed God by writing what I just did. What I wrote above can be taken quite the wrong way. God has moved in my life powerfully, I have been greatly touched by Him, and He has done wonderful things for me.
However, I do struggle to stay in relationship with Him more than anyone I have ever heard of or known. Don’t take what I wrote above as meaning that God is not the answer or that He does not fulfill His promises.
I don’t want to criticize the church either. People are people no matter where they are. There are great wonderful people in church and there are wicked terrible people in church. There are so many different churches with different experiences in them that it is nearly impossible to typify ‘the’ church today. I was just saying I don’t feel like I fit in church because I find it very hard to identify with the kind of Christians I wish I could identify with.
Well, I feel like I’m digging with a plastic spoon out of a concrete pit I’ve made with my words. I like God….I love God but the majority of the time I don’t ‘get it.’ I don’t get the relationship thing because I’m talking to someone I can’t see, hear, feel, or touch and hoping everything someday will all make sense. I know I’m not the only one out there not ‘getting it.’
Maybe I should just quite typing! HA!
Hi John Paul,
I pray that you recover fully and quickly, in the name of Jesus.
To answer your first question “Why is this type of program so popular?”
I think just like others have commented is that there is a spiritual awakening or hunger in people and they will respond to that which may be popular [just like fashion] whether it be right or wrong.
It is a shame that Oprah has steadily been going down a path that is headed the opposite direction of the way [the way being the way of Christ].
But being in her position and the clout that she has, she pulls in a large audience. Also the trust that she has biult over the years will cause people to ‘follow her’.
I heard of a preacher once who knew Elvis Presley and would talk to him about Christ and Elvis would cry and cry saying ‘I know, I know’ because the preacher knew and so did Elvis that he had a following of many and could have easily led them to Christ. [I could be wrong about the details]. My point is that Oprah knows or seems to know the Truth and the Source but seems to want to deny it’s existence or not fully acknowledge it but wants to mix it with other stuff to make it work for her.
Reading of Mr Tolle and having not heard of Him before makes me think of Mohammed and how Islam came about - it was due to Mohammed being enlightened isn’t it?
The next question “What do you believe should be done about this?”
I will start by giving a brief acoount of a lady I met this Sunday - she is the mother of one of the girls in my church.
I walked up to her to introduce myself and it was like I walked in the presence of the Holy Spirit. It was like she wore the Lord around her like a garment.
This caught my attention and we started talking as to how she got to where the presence of God and his power was evident in her life so powerfully - she talked about consecration and dying to self. I was intrigued by what I heard and experienced while talking to her and it seemed like everyone who came around her was affected - even one young girl just cried most of the time she was around this lady and got ministered too in an amazing way.
If all Christians or most of us walked in this kind of relationship with God then would the world go to Oprah and others who say that they have spiritual enlightenment?
Won’t they come to us? Because we have allowed God to be God in out lives and as a result manifest Him fully or to the degree He chooses rather than we choosing it.
Isn’t this what happened with the disciples?
I desire to have God flow through me, His fire burning in me, and others and I think then we can begin to affect this world in a relevant way.
John Paul, Thank you for giving us a place to air our views. But most importantly thank you for the answers you provide as they really help to grasp things of The Light and respond to them appropriately.
Look forward to reading your views
Sam W, London, England.
Perhaps I can give a view from the other side of the world?
I am a New Zealander. I have had times when I have watched Oprah, and these sorts of programs.
In repsonse to:
1. Why is this type of program popular? I believe a large part of Oprahs popularity is that she knows how to connect with people and to a large degree allows them to journey with her. I dont know her faith or what she believes in regards to Jesus. I think we need to be really careful in regards to making judgments about someones faith (or anything).
2.What do you believe should be done about this? We can blame an apathetic church. But you know what, I reckon the church is great and it becomes what we expect it to be. Some churches that we would think dead by outer appearances are actually hives of Holy Spirit activity once we get past our own expectations of the church and how we think the Holy Spirit should work.
Do you think it is a little strange that a TV program and a web seminar could ruffle the church? I am not sure how I think on that yet. Do we feel threatened by this? And if we do..why?
Is this out of perspective? i.e. it appears a larger issue than it really is? I guess that what I am trying to say is that this kind of issue will not weigh as highly for some people than others. And from the other side of the world it doesnt seem as big.
p.s. I love this site?
Speaking of Oprah….there is an upcoming show on recurring dreams and/or nightmares. I just copied the following from her site:
Does the same dream pop into your sleep night after night? Are you awakened by a recurring nightmare that has been haunting you for years? Do you wonder about the meaning of a dream or nightmare that simply won’t go away?
The Oprah Winfrey Show is looking for people willing to share their recurring dreams or nightmares — provide all the details of your dream, when it started, the frequency, and what you think it might mean.
So…it is high time for Christians to invade the media. Why not have John Paul on Oprah intrepreting dreams? I say “YES” to that….how about you John Paul?
John Paul….I do hope you feel better. Your insights are both intriguing and though provoking. Given that learning to know more how closely we truly are to The One (God) who loves us always, that is ALWAYS good.
As for Oprah’s latest foray into the world of mysticism, The Baby Boom Generation as a whole is moving closer and closer toward a sense of what is eternal….Some would say “death.” Each and every generation has their moment of trying to make sense of what is mystical. The Purpose Driven Life, Joel Osteen, and now Oprah are just one of the many, in prominent positions who are guiding the many others who seek God.
We need to remember how not to fool ourselves into believing such a spiritual journey occurs only when we move into our senior years. Althrough our life we have an ongoing conversation with The One in you and I about what makes life great and exciting.
The Baby Boomers are a huge segment of the American population. And, given this generations reach through the various forms of media, it is also likely there are Boomers in other nations reaching deeper into what makes for a great relationship with God. Oprah’s audience gathers because she represents what they feel is the mult-faceted (sounds like multi-tasked)character of what it means to be feminine in 2008.
With so many asking the question “How really close are we to God?” only the most enormous discoveries about how truly great we all are can surface. It must be noted, this time of mysticism does not mean we will have peace in our times. No, this is a time when war floats to the surface in a most unique way as well. For what is percieved to be a stake is the “Idea of what IS God?” And, that always evokes the delusional to fight for their version and vision of what is God.
Regardless the size of the generation in which you might find yourself, Life is a good thing to live. However, it must as well be noted, when the last of The Boomers will have taken their last breaths we will have witnessed the largest innovation upon the inspirations of all of what has been accomplished spiritually by the most inspired that came before us. We will will ourselves to discover how truly loved we are….and loved right NOW.
AngllHugnU2
Author of IM with God
After listening to Eckhart Tolle on youtube and then reading some exerpts online, I’m having flash-backs of growing up with my hippie dad. When I’d fall down skiing, he’d say, “You can get up, its’ only your ego.” Yeah ok? My ego never did help me get up. About Oprah, what can I say? The Big Giver makes me think of those friends you have that think they have to buy your love. Oprah gives to buy love? Just a thought. She really has become a lot like the rest of Hollywood, embracing all religions hoping to find peace and joy, she needs a glory encounter!
Healing is the childrens bread I left John Paul up to your arms of grace wrap your loving arms around him and wash him clean from all flu symptoms by His strips you are healed I curse and command all bacteries and virus’ in the the spirit realm to die attacking John Paul his body will live and declare the works of the Lord in the Land of the Living in Jesus Name there is power in the Name. Thank you Lord so it is Shalom
Why is this program so popular? I think that many people feel safe following someone else and letting that person either take the fall or receive the applause publicly. The only pieces of info I have taken note of have been the public support and then public gracious admission of having been deceived, and facing the deceiver without malice, yet coming away feeling as if justice has been achieved (some book author, and another incident recently were revealed as being false). Ophrah faced the situation and/or person publicly and moved on which leaves her followers feeling safe and justified. Her followers can let the blame fall on her shoulders, yet still have felt their SOUL touched at some point. (Their spirit is another matter.)
What do you believe should be done about this? I have no thought that hasn’t been addressed already. I tend to wait in the shadows to help be a repairer of the breach, an extended hand of Christ to those who are looking and see something (or someOne?) in me that can bring light. (My sphere of influence is yet very small, but important in God’s eye!) A term that comes to my mind right now is ‘White Shadow’, hidden yet bringing light when possible.
I am not familiar with Eckhart Tolle so I did a search on the internet to find out about him. I read a little of some of his teachings and I also watched him on You Tube. I really can’t understand why anyone would be drawn to this person or to what he is teaching. To be honest with you, I found him to be quite boring. I don’t get it. I believe that people are looking for something spiritual. Because they have not experienced the presence of God, they are deceived into settling for a counterfeit. Unfortunately, many of the churches today offer religion and there is not a tangible presence of God. I think the answer to this is that the true church needs to go to the lost with the presence of God. Once people experience the true presence of God, their eyes will be opened and they will see God for who he really is. I am not familiar with all of the New Age practices, but I know when I am confronted with a counterfeit. That is because I have experienced the real thing.
Praise the Lord Brother John Paul it is always a blessing to read and listen to your teaching. I know this comment has nothing to do with this particular topic but I couldn’t resist not mentioning it wow, gee thank you so much for the cd teaching you made on prophets and psychics, wow every creation of God needs a copy in their library now that was such a blessing because I always tell people not go go to psychics it was a sin and it opens door way for satan to enter their lives but I did could never explain it until I ordered that from cbd. I just got of the Army after serving for 10 and half years and as you know we soldiers traveled a lot so I always had to make sure I had to invest in all God’s teaching through cds, dvd, books, mp3 etc just to make sure I never quench the fire of me seeking the Lord at all times.
Oprah is not a spiritual leader she is just a destruction of the enemy and it so sad. Everything that looks good, rich etc doesn’t mean it is good for us. Being a soldiers for many many years I had so many chances to fail God and taken the easy way out but the truth I could not do it. I always found myself all alone but at least I knew I had not compromise my walk with my Lord and that made me happy to pick up my cross and follow the Lord everyday. Was it easy no but the Lord kept me because I wanted to be kept by Him. I will rather be poor than to sell my soul to the devil. The truth is all of us Christian we need to pray for all these Oprah followers so that the Lord will open their eyes. Oprah has lots of influence in America, if we Christian don’t start praying about this it will cause lots of damage in America. She even have influence in politics and the politicians they know that and that is why they use. I think most of the time as the body of Chirst we wait until things, people and situation become a torn before we do something about but we need to act now and that is by us praying for a divine intervention from the Lord.
Stay bless all
“What does it mean” that people are looking for peace, for recognition, for their purpose in life, and for the supernatural? To me it shouts a challenge for the church to become more relevant to human needs.
It reaffirms that religion isn’t and has never been enough and that we can provide real answers to their real needs by offering them peace, purpose and the supernatural through a relationship with God.
I believe people are spiritually hungry. They are seeking the truth about who they are and what the are here for. The Church on the whole has failed to guide people into their destiny and calling outside of the four walls of the church building. As such people are looking to other sources where the supposed limits are boundless instead of finding it in a vibrant and dynamic relationship with our Father where we become the salt and light of the earth. We bring Gods solutions to the problems we face and edify and encourage everyone in all spheres of life such as government, education, family, business etc.
People will accept truth even when it is wrapped in subtle nuances that can entrap us. I believe that as the Body of Christ matures we should be able to discern truth from error through discernment in the Holy Spirit.
At least Oprah is trying to be the best she can be and help as many people she can along the way. She is the Fathers daughter and is expressing the Heart of God in the best way she knows how. God is God of all and uses all things for our benefit. She is there because Father has her there and I pray the Spirit of God will lead her.
Is she not expression the generosity of God?
Just some thoughts from a Son of the King.
there are three scripture that will answer most questions matt-9:49 matt:7:17 and john1:17 if it is not of God it will fail. hugs
I hope my response does not seem too simplistic or off the wall, but this type of program could only be popular in America and Western Europe where kool aid religion tickles the senses. Make no mistake about it, Oprah is popular all over the world, but more as a philantrophist in third world nations. Nobody, but nobody, sees Oprah as any kind of spirtual leader in the region of the world where I am from.
For us, the supernatural is serious business. Whether through the local witch doctor or through a Spirit filled church. So Oprah’s worship-the-earth-heal-the-world-let’s-hold-hands-and-reach-inwards-for-the-miracle kind of foolishness has no traction. Certainly she is flirting with the occult, but this holds no kind of wild eyed appeal because we understand that she is like a child playing with dynamite.
So to answer JP’s question, I think her program has such appeal here for a couple of reasons:
Men rather darkness than light because their deeds are inherently evil. Sometimes we blame the church when men turn to the works of darkness. That is not always true. Remember Adam and Eve still took that which was forbidden although they had the tree of life from which they could freely partake.
Another reason, as other have stated. is that either cessationism or hype have gained a stronghold in many western churches. When I first came to America, I could not believe that there were whole churches who built doctrines around the belief that the Holy Spirit sent his miracle working power back to Heaven after the apostolic era. One brother I met tried to convince me using some badly mangled Scripture verse. I was overcome with pity. What a poor sampling of the Christian experience he must have!
On the other side of the coin is the hype and slight of hand that passes for power in many charismatic churches. It is no wonder that people often turn to worthless philosophies and psuedo-religion as a poor substitute.
Blessings,
Nazach
I see that this program speaks of and glorifies the soul of man. The source is the tree of good and evil and there is enough truth in what is being proclaimed to deceive; it stimulates and feeds the soul.
What do I believe should be done? Pray that the lie and deception is revealed, repent for the people’s sin, for allowing this influence to be so prevalent and proclaim the truth, the good news and show the love of God with signs and wonders following.
Bless God Forever.
I admit I am still learning to discern. I’ve went to Eckhart’s website and watched 2 u tube videos of him speaking. Please don’t bash me as I will not retaliate, I am speaking what I am feeling in my spirit, this man is possessed. We need to pray for him, Oprah and all those signed up for the classes. Wouldn’t hurt to miss a few meals either.
If we are to only live in the now, what is the use of prophecy, dreams or visions? Why should God speak to us except only for the moment? Why would He have plans for our future?
He is using enough of the Bible to confuse those that cannot Spiritually discern or who are not grounded in the Word of God.
This has undertones of the “Do what thou will” of satanism. Only it’s hidden under a pretense of being spiritual.
1 John 4:1-3 (King James Version)
1Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.
2Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:
3And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.
Blessings,
Joy
I have been praying for Oprah for years. I see her emptiness and I she is receiving from her giving but still she is empty. She definitely sowing but as a previous blogger noted - not of GOD will come to an end.
In CHRIST and lifting up your health.
Elaine
My heart aches when I see people in pain. But they must be open and receive the truth of GOD’s unconditional love. I suspect the truth has been told but where is the application? The Law of giving and recieving does not change - it is the heart that needs the change.
I am not a blogger as of yet, but this is my second blog in 5 days so wow, maybe I am. I posted this out cry on Oprah’s message board, or one of them. So this is what I think, I hadn’t heard about the topic at hand but was concerned about Oprah leading people to the “Course in Miracles”, which does tie in, I am concerned for her and will pray for this situation daily.
I think this kind of programming is popular because Satan is on the war path, he see’s us getting a clue and kicking down all four sides of the box that we were so willing to live in in the past. God’s anointing His people, his common, everyday folk and opening our minds to who we really are in Him, ROYALTY, sons and daughters of the Most High King, starting to claim and stand on the inheritance that is ours.
Hello, my name is Lisa Gallant Seal. I feel prompted to respond to a very disturbing email I received today. It was an alert sent out by a Christian friend of mine letting me know that The Oprah Winfrey show is campaigning for “The Course in Miracles” and inviting people to take part in a 365 day study program in a belief system that does not believe in sin or hell, the founder says that Jesus Christ talked to them for 7 years and told them to write these things down (check out John 4:1-6 in the Holy Bible before you read on).
My heart is sickened as I have had much respect for Oprah in the past and have seen that her heart is sincere in helping people move forward in their own personal journeys. She seems to also have a huge heart cry for the less fortunate. I think it is naive for this talk show giant to involve herself in promoting politicians, religious, and spiritual, evangelical or “what have you” movements. I think it is good to have representatives on these subjects on her show (like she has in the past) to give her fans and audiences opportunities to decide for themselves in the truths these organizations or politicians have to offer. But to say to her crowds of millions “this is the way, and join me in this book study”, or “this is the person everybody should vote for” could be like leading a sweet lamb to slaughter or some serious consequences for ones future rights to freedom. We are not talking about “green tea” or “a good healthy diet” or “emotional healing”. We are talking about an individual’s soul’s salvation, and an individual’s freedom. I am also concerned for Oprah, I still believe that she has a heart for her people, her fans and audiences around the world, but our society is unfortunately an idolizing and very easily influenced public. People of influence hold a great responsibility to their public and to the truth.
I think Oprah can following whoever she wants as far as her spiritual journey or who she wants to put in the Oval Office and so on, but please, for Oprah’s sake and the sake of our hearts and country let us help people decide what to believe without strong influence of an Oprah figure, or any popular celebrity. Let us also start demanding some accountability from the famous people who are popular, held in high regard and in the public eye. Don’t forget that it is politically incorrect and maybe illegal, (I don’t know that illegal statement for a fact) for our pastors and priest to preach politics from the pulpit. If this makes sense to you please voice your opinion. I am sure that Oprah wants to hear the truth from you if you have concerns with her actions. Remember, the fans and the public are ultimatly in control even though we tend to forget this powereful fact.
I believe the reason people are flocking to them is the hunger for spirituality. You imply that even though that hunger is there why is church attendance dwindling. There was a great exodus from the church in the 90’s. That’s when we left. Does that mean we don’t love our Lord or we don’t fellowship, absolutely not. On the contrary there are many of us that travel the world to share the gospel. There are so many of us out here. Was in BC last summer and looked up people we always had great fellowship with and guess what, they too have left the church, the building that is. I believe that we are called to love, to love Yah, then our neighbor, love covers a multitude of sins.
As long as she reveals the truth that salvation is through Jesus Christ, and that he is the Door. Without him we are nothing. Are totally dependent on him? or can we do it ourselves? Have we as a people EVOLVED spiritually to the point that we do not need to enter in the same way we have always come into the Kingdom. I still havn’t forgotten the message The Apostle Peter preached on the day of pentecost where he laid out the basics of entrance into the kingdom. Slowly it seems that people are finding a more comfortable route? or are they? Im sorry, I believe I like the Old fashion way, and will preach it until I leave this short life. Good old repentace, baptism, and Jesus Name baptism never hurt anyone physically. It’ll sure hurt the pride, but what of it? I wonder if she mentions Hell as an alternative route to those who do believe and obey the gospel? Nope sorry give me a good old apostilic move of God, one with Demonstration and Power, where the gifts of the spirit are building up the Body, not the human spirit finding self?! I believe this stuff is Good if you are not searching for an intimate walk with God, but if you want that then Pick up that old cross and follow him, lol sorry the Old fashion way is best. Seek God, pray, fast, meditate ON THE WORD, listen for his voice, DESIRE TO SEE HIS FACE, and walk with him, thats it plain and simple. Let us know what you think John Paul…..
I was reading about this book on Amazon, and was pretty much horrified. He uses biblical language and terms(even the title!) and reappropriates them to New Age philosophies. This can only lead to confusion in the Body, and lead astray people who were raised with the Bible but are not walking with the Lord.
Personally, I keep praying Oprah will get saved, because she certainly has a lot of power over people. As she is currently, I believe she’s very dangerous, even though her intentions are good. I also pray that the church will rise in power and be able to bring the truth to the world so they will not be so easily led astray…
Having spent several hours at different intervals on Oprah’s message board in regards to “The New Earth” I feel very distressed, yet affirmed, that God does indeed intend to direct our footing as to our place in the world. Thus I have stubbled upon this feed that has encouraged me. For years I have felt the Lord directing me to watch Oprah from time to time asking “Christian or New Age?” We left a Christian Church years ago that had several New Age Sunday School leaders. The Lord led me to confront each of them before leaving in a very gentle way that made them come out of the closet. Yet the Church to this day continues to leave these teachers in leadership. Why? Because they profess to be Christians while teaching New Age. New Age claims it does not conflict with Christians, but is in addition bringing a more spiritual life. Through my quest to open the eyes of professing Christians as to the intent of “The New Earth” God led several of us to draw out His Truth in order that unaware Christians would have their eyes open to the deception of Oprah. We, as Christians, do not know each other, but are one in His Spirit. I could write forever the differences between New Age and Christianity. However, through the course of declaring Jesus Christ is the only Way to God, I found a website with an on-line book titled “Reinventing Jesus Christ, The New Gospel” by Warren Smith. His book says it all and tells us of Oprah’s full awareness to spread New Age. The website is http://www.reinventingjesuschrist.com. I printed out the book and my two daughters will be reading the book during spring break so that they will become fully aware to the New Revelations that New Age plans to bring into our World. My husband has patientely listened to me for days saying that it could never happen. Then one day we were sitting at the table and I asked him to consider history and that in our very lifetime we experienced Hitler. And we can trace man’s history to regular periods that our world began to claim Satan’s desire–let me become my own god. This is New Ages desire. My husband’s eyes were opened and my daughters are in agreement because one of their loves is history…they understand the threat before them in their very lifetime.
Pray, yes, we must. We can spend time talking about our failures as Christ’s Church and remember that not all who proclaim Jesus Lord will be recognized by him when he comes. In fact, he promises many will do just that. I have long pondered over how that can be. These last two week having listened to the first webscast and lived among New Agers on the message board, I understand. You see, Oprah proclaimed that the Baptist minister lied to her congregation when she was in her 20’s. He said that God is a jealous God. At that point she decided he didn’t know God at all. She believes in Universal Energy and call it “god.” She also states that she is a Christian who believes that there are many ways, not just Jesus. That’s on the first webcast while Mr. Tolle proclaims that his book is not only New Age, but the next step. Oprah on her after-the-show videos at her website has 2 for “The New Earth.” At the end of one, a Christian woman stands up and says, “I am a Christian. Is this book something that would help me as a Christian or is it New Age?” Oprah says, “If you are a Christian that believes there are many way, you will be enhanced with this study.” Then the video is over. Notice on her shows that professing Christians have their words restated by Oprah to New Age standards or she dismiss what is said. She is a talk show host well-trained.
So I end here hoping that you will read the on-line book, continue in your prayers, and that God will lead you each individually to take action according to His purpose. Thank you so much for being her for me this hour. I so needed to hear sound reasoning from Christians after a couple of weeks listening to disheartened church goers and New Age inductees.
Listening and reading for weeks how the Lord’s Word is being taken out of context page by page in this book grieves me so.
You have blessed me this moment. Thank you, my dear sisters and brothers in Christ! May our Lord use you to save many!
Your Sister in Christ,
Cheryl
I will confess, that maybe after reading all the responses, that this blog has opened a whole realm of ‘cans of worms’ that i hadnt’ even thought were out there.
I am alittle surprised at the shock and horror that some people are projecting over this issue. I mean, I don’t even think its that big of an issue, sure its soul-based, sure eckart tolle probably has demons (who really doesn’t? most christians I have met do have lots of demons on them), sure oprah likes a course in miracles (i have read parts of the book myself, and there is some wheat in the midst of chaff) but why are we as beleivers so surpised?
Is it surprising that satan quoted scriptures to Jesus? Sunday morning rolls around and most churches are preaching scriptures, and yet many of them don’t even beleive what they are preaching, many of them twist the scriptures to their liking. Is it any wonder that people in the new age are using scripture for their own views? is that so terribly different than religious people? I remember hearing someone speak one time on the ‘worship of the BIble instead of the God of the Bible’ it was a good message.
I also am going to shoot out a big long controversial statement here. (And I am not picking on any one) but I don’t beleive in sin anymore either. Well sure it exists. Sure its a very ‘real’ thing and concept in a fallen world, but once I reside in Christ Jesus, sin is no longer in existence. WHat is right and wrong suddenly falls under the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. There is good there, and there is evil. I think Christians obsess about sins, and then they live the sins out. How many preachers who are against homosexuals end up having homosexual relations? a WHOLE LOT of them. Why? Because they focused and put their life work as stopping a particular ’sin.’
Is it true that ‘what you behold you become?” in which case the christian world has a problem beholding and preaching on sin a whole lot, and they become a cesspool of darkness. Why not forget about sin, and BEHOLD JESUS in all his glory, and let him change you to himself, let his life flow out. I don’t live my life to ferret out sin, I live my life in relationship with God, and when there is somethign I am not supposed to do or go, he says “son, go here, say this, don’t go there, avoid that, don’t touch.. touch this not that, etc etc etc”
I beleive that instead of seeing what is wrong about Oprah and Eckart, maybe we should view them as people, who are children of God, who are lost children, who have possibly forgotten about their creation before time, but yet, they still are created in the ‘image of GOd’ and therefor are still reflective of God our father (and the mothering el shaddai side of God too..) So, maybe if we view them as people who are in the process of awakening to Dads love again, maybe they would suddenly have a revelation>? I don’t think Oprahs giving has anything to do with her being seen as a spiritual leader, I think it just is a by product of her search for spiritual truth. If you listed to the webcast and heard her talking about her growing in the baptist church, you hear not a person who is desiring deception, but a person who genuinely is seeking God, and she will find him, he Loves her and will reveal himself to her. In fact, alot of what Tolle Speaks on is not new one bit. Much of it seems very highly influenced by the new age “Findhorn” community. If you research the amazing miracles and beleif in God they had in their early years you could imagine why this philosphy is so attractive. I mean a society where no one has to work? A society and community where when anything is needed they ask of God and it suddenly appears without striving or effort, they just ask simply “we need a greenhouse” and the next day when everyone awakens early in teh morning a new greenhouse is built and on the property! And the dirt is not moved like there was any building happening in the middle of the night (the book ‘the magic of findhorn’ is well worth a read for people who aren’t afraid of the darkness) Eckhart Tolle has spent time speaking at the Findhorn retreat so I imagine that influenced him somehow. I am just sharing things I have read, but what happened if people who claim to know Jesus had as much trust, hope, and utter faith and abandonment for JESUS as this community did to the divine force of nature, God.??
It seems to me they are accessing things whether its dark or light, through spirit and soul manifestations, and who wouldn’t want to be a part of that if they knew that every need was ALWAYS supplied, and the joy of life and BEing was allowed to manifest in each person? Not all their views are based in spirit of course, and Eileen Cadddy one of the founders of the community has some strange ideals..But imagine for a moment a church who actually received by faith and accepted the totality of the gospel!!!!! (I can hear John G lake in HEaven saying amen to that one..LOL)
I think we could sum all these issues and worries about Oprah and Eckhart into one simple thing: “beholding Jesus you will know that which is of his character, his beauty, his glory, anything else is not life, not light, not our source and should be avoided.” period.
But i don’t beleive that we should fear the darkness. Darkness is merely twisted light, and so for the deep spirit individual you must descend into hellish places to help others see light and be set free. Allow your faith in God to trust that he never leaves you, never forsakes you, that even if you ‘descend into the depths of sheol’ that he is there with you. Do we understand that?
I decided to watch Oprahs \event with Eckhart Tolle because while I find Tolle rather boring and dull, I am not really a fan of Oprah either, but it was an interesting discussion. People were asking them questions about their christianity and merging that with the ideals of what Eckhart was saying.. alot of what Eckart was saying could classify as the ‘good’ part of the tree of good and evil. But its still the wrong tree.
I thank God for the New Age movement, because As they seek Higher consciousness they are actually moving directly into the hands of Christ Jesus. They are searching truth and light, and “he who seeks finds, he who knocks, the door will be upon unto him”
The doors of our nation are opening, new age gurus all over are having visions of Christ JEsus as Lord. If the church will remain silent, God will allow people to pursue the wrong things in an attempt to reach him so he can bring them into his goodness.
The great reversal has arrived and it is my beleif that the new age and occult world will suddenly be dumped into the kingdom of God when Truth manifests, and the great darkness of religion and soulish christianity will be seen as the false Christ and the dark satanism of unbeleif, doubt, and lies shall be revealed.
It will take spirit eyes to see the great shift, but many are being awakened, and even darkness is used for Gods glory, because the entire universe revolves around the One True God. WHat I see is that What the spirit is doing now in America was what God wanted to do during the Jesus movement, but the nation wasn’t ready, so instead of the west coast, it is now happening in the silent ways on the east coast, eventually to crescendo and move through the nation.. and the world, a re-awakening of people to the absolute wonder of their salvation, of what Jesus did for them, of the intimate relationship they can have with the God of the universe and “the spirit and the bride say come”
If the Lord is your light, what philosphy, religion, movement, etc etc.. shall you ever fear?
Maybe you are nearing the time of appearing on her show.
I have been reading the book and watching the webcasts. I also consider myself a Christian, as I believe in Jesus Christ as my savior. Is it possible that Jesus is not the only savior? Could there be others who appeared in different parts of the world so that God could reach more people? We find God through Jesus. Does it really matter how people come to be close to God? From reading this book, I don’t find that Eckhart Tolle is trying to get me to change my beliefs at all. Everything I have read has made me look at my actions and caused me to look more internally…. into my soul, yes, but also to experience God all around us and inside of us. Is this anti-christian??
“Everything I have read has made me look at my actions and caused me to look more internally…. into my soul, yes, but also to experience God all around us and inside of us.”
Perfect Lisa! Perfect!
In fact, everything everyone has offered here is perfect. From each we learn the depth of our desire to take notice of how close we truly are with God. Eventually, as if we were walking into a party together we will say of of relationship with God “I’m with God!”
AngllHugnU2
Author of IM with God
Wow. Hot topic. I’m new to your blog JP, thanks for making yourself available. Thank you for being a spiritual father, we need you, strength to you.
Re: Eckhart
I lived in Holland for 6 months and a Dutch neighbour heard me chatting with someone about the body, soul and spirit. He immediately began to ask me questions and was very thoughtful about what he heard me say. He knew I am a Christian who believes absolute truth exists. He said I should read Eckhart’s book. So I did, out of respect and love for this man’s soul. I studied and cross-referenced with scripture; I read ‘More than a Carpenter’ at the same time. I wrote my comments in the pages of Eckhart’s book. My Dutch neighbour was totally surprised to hear that I actually took his advice and read the book (I also noticed he put a big Bible in his window so I could see it I’m sure). As a parting gift I wrote a letter (with all my contact info) and I gave my copy of the book to him, along with ‘More than a Carpenter’ and a Christian booklet explaining the DaVinci Code (the Dutchman made a comment about my name in reference to the movie/book). He was surprised that I felt I didn’t need to keep Eckhart’s book for myself. I haven’t heard from him, but I believe God has planted a seed.
Bottom line about Eckhart’s philosophy:
You don’t need Jesus Christ. Although Eckhart quotes Jesus, he ignores the truth that Jesus is the only way the Father.
Eckhart has an undeniable gift and he has much good advice that works, to a degree, but it cannot give life because his “wisdom” is derived from the other tree. Mere good falls short of life.
Our answer to this will be to submit ourselves completely to the refining work of Holy Spirit in our lives so that we are transformed into the image of Christ. We must draw close to hear the Father’s plan and purpose for us individually and corporately and then walk it out in faith. When we know our utter not-good-enoughness, yet know He loves us anyway (and we show that kind of love to others) and that He delights to show Himself strong in our weakness, we can joyfully spread the good news, which then I believe will be confirmed with signs and wonders.
Magdalena
Yes the people are hungry for answers, but going to the wrong places. lets get back to basics these are the last days Jesus is returning soon, the enemy plans to make sure that many souls are lost. through alternatives(other religions)to a relationship with jesus Christ.
The spirit of deception is running riot, just because something looks good and may sound good, it doesn’t mean it’s God, The devil must be laughing as he continues to lead people astray.
We need to continue to spread the good news to the lost, all the answers are in Gods word and through revelation of the holy spirit. I won’t judge Oprah God will Judge i’ll just pray for her.
What can be done about this is the wrong question to ask. There is nothing to be done when people are embracing concisenesses and love. Most people don’t really understand the meaning behind the words in the bible unless you really understand the language behind it. Not many really do. So to say that people are lost by following a practice in spirituality seems a bit ignorant of the bigger picture of life.
Take stock in why you are distressed about people becoming more spiritual. Look into yourself instead of looking for a reason outside yourself, if you do that you will find the answer as god is apart of us.